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The following is an interview in which I ask my grandmother, Paula A, about her experience during her first days of the pandemic. My grandmother is in her late 70’s, and has been to the hospital during this pandemic (not covid-19), as well as lived during the time of the AIDS/HIV epidemic. The interview took place over a phone call, in the beginning of October. I, Nicole Arena, am indicated by the non-italicized portions and my grandmother is indicated by the italicized below.
Hi Gigi!
Hi Nik, how are you?
Good, how are you?
I’m good.
Okay, so first off I just to need to get your consent for the interview. Do you give consent to be interviewed for inclusion in an online archive, including Rutgers Libraries and, possibly, the Humanities Action Lab?
Yes, you have my permission.
Okay, good. Well, actually, I just realized that because this is over the phone and not in person I’m not getting, like, a physical signature. You know what, just to be safe I am going to-can you write it out on a piece of paper and then sign it and send me a picture just so I have it?
Yes, that’s fine. I can do that.
Okay, thanks. So for when I write the interview up, how do you want to be identified? You can do your full name, first name only…whatever you’re comfortable with.
Paula A. Paula A is good.
Okay. Paula A. So, I want to ask you about your very first days of the pandemic, around the time the World Health Organization announced officially that this was a pandemic. This was March 11th. So, I was wondering if you knew what you were doing around then, give or take a few days? I know it was a long time ago, but is there anything that stands out to you around that time about what you were doing? Maybe you remember going to the store for something, or just generally remembering watching the news a lot, anything you remember? It’s okay if you don’t remember exactly what you were physically doing too much.
Well…I do remember watching CNN quite a bit and keeping up with the latest news about what was happening in New York. Did it concern me? Not too much about it becoming widespread in the United States. It really did not concern me too much in the beginning, because I figured we’re in America, and we can get most things under control. We have great medicine, doctors, and we’d know how to control things. I thought we’d do much better than other countries.
Do you remember how you were feeling when you heard that this was a global pandemic? Were you anxious, scared, or didn’t really give it much thought?
Not at the very beginning. I wasn’t too much concerned in the beginning.
Did you think at the time that it would be as large scale as it has become?
No, I did not think it was going to be this large scale. When I really became concerned was in the middle of march when Jen (her daughter) told me Rutgers was going to go online. Then I really changed my mind and I became very concerned. It (my concern) progressed very rapidly. When I heard that I thought wow, this is very serious, because school never closes down. And the churches. Never in my lifetime did church close, so that was, you know, really big. And that was in the middle of March, so it progressed rapidly.
You made homemade masks during the pandemic. How early on did you make them, and why? Did someone tell you to make them, did you hear the news saying they should be made, or did you just make them to be safe?
I heard on tv that there was a shortage of masks for healthcare workers, so I donated material and elastic, because I was a seamstress and had the materials, to an organization that made masks for healthcare workers. Then, at the very beginning, they were telling the public that we did not need to be concerned, but then I thought, “Well I can sew, so I’ll make for some for myself and my family also just to be on the safe side.”
Do you remember when you actually started making the masks?
Oh yeah, it was really pretty early on, in March. I donated as soon as I heard about the shortage and then I started making them for my family, the homemade masks. I made them even though they had fairies and flamingos on the material (laughs). I still thought it would be better than nothing.
I actually uploaded a picture of the mask you made me to the website we’re using for class last Tuesday! The woman helping us learn about the website asked me about it, and I told her mine was really girly with fairies.
Oh how funny! You know I was actually thinking about this the other day after I had my dream. I was thinking you know you only have that one mask that I made you, and you need another one. So next time you come over you take another one as a backup, alright?
Well I mostly wear this one and just wash it, but Thank you! Um, speaking of masks, what do you think about people who refuse to wear masks in public?
You know. I should have mentioned this before. This was actually another one of my big concerns at the beginning. When I realized the severity of the pandemic, and the fact that our president downplayed it, it was a big force of anger for me! Wait, I’m sorry, what was your question again?
That’s okay. I just asked how you felt about those who refuse to wear masks in public.
Selfish, starting from our president down. I think they are self-centered and have total disregard for other people. They should have more consideration for other people. Truthfully, I think they are ignorant of reality.
Mmm, Yes. Okay, so next question. Kind of a longer one. When the WHO announced we were in a pandemic, what was your sense of government response? Did you think they were not cautious enough? Too cautious? How do you think the government has handled the pandemic up until this point?
Federal or state? Well, for state I think the Governor handles it very well, because he follows scientific guidelines and the recommendations of the CDC. And New York too. Federal government though handled it so poorly, and with total disregard to the scientific recommendations of the CDC. That’s the distinction between the two. I had the news on and listened to reports from Governor Cuomo and Murphy every day in the beginning, because they followed scientific guidelines. But I totally disregarded the President, except when Dr. Fauci was on. Then I would watch.
Right. So, you experienced the HIV/AIDS epidemic in the 80’s. Do you recall the beginning of that epidemic, and how you felt? Was it similar to how you felt in March, or did one or the other have more of a sense of urgency than the other?
This pandemic had more of a sense of urgency, because covid affects every single human being. I considered my family and myself safe during the AIDS epidemic, because we were not candidates for AIDS at that point. This pandemic now involves the whole population, whereas AIDS was a targeted population. When I heard about this pandemic, it had a much greater impact… Although I did have compassion for people suffering with AIDS, and it was definitely worrisome… but not as much as this one.
Okay, so you’re a part of the age group that’s more susceptible to the coronavirus. How has this impacted your experience with the pandemic? Do you think you’re more cautious than others because of this? Do you think you have a little bit more worry than other people?
Well…uh… I don’t know how to answer that. I’m not as cautious as my daughter, even though she is younger than me and I’m older and was hospitalized because I had a fever and couldn’t breathe in early June. They said it wasn’t covid. I’m not as cautious as the two people that live with me, my son and daughter. I mean I am cautious, but not as cautious as they are. I don’t know, it’s for some reason I’m just not as worried as they are…and they’re very cautious so I know they won’t bring it into the house. Maybe if they were going out or going to parties or went here and there maybe I’d be more worried then, but I am just not that worried about myself. I also don’t go out myself. I do have worries about others though. Like people who are going to school, and young people who need to socialize, and those who go to work like Joey (my brother, her grandson), you know the essential workers, and healthcare workers. I’m more concerned about them than myself.
You were in the hospital over the summer. Can you tell me how that experience was? What did you go there for, what was the atmosphere/ general feeling in the hospital? How long were you there? Were you scared you had covid-19, or scared in general?
I thought I could have covid, because it had been years since I had a fever and I did have trouble breathing… even though I tested negative for covid. I felt I had excellent care in the hospital and that I was really was getting the best care. The atmosphere- well to tell you the truth… it was like a morgue. Nobody was there, the halls were all empty because there were no visitors allowed, and I think there were not too many covid patients in the hospital at that time. That was in early June. It was actually very scary at one point, because for one day and one night I couldn’t breathe. I was in the ICU on oxygen then, and that’s when I got worried-when they transported me to the ICU unit. Fortunately, I recovered quickly. The doctors say it was a miracle. They still don’t know what it was.
I thought they said you had pneumonia?
Yes, I did. But they don’t know what caused the pneumonia or what brough it on. It really came on very quickly, but I was out in seven days.
Do you know anyone who has passed or been affected by covid-19, and what were your feelings when you heard about it?
Your Dad’s friend Gary. He suffered for more than thirty days before he passed, and we got daily updates on his progress. Daddy was very concerned. And then the man down the block your Dad spoke to. He passed away in one weeks time. When I heard that, I thought it was really getting close to home. And now Jason (grandson, nineteen years old) has the coronavirus. I was sort of not surprised, because I understand how young people, especially with the summer and being cooped up in the house for so long, wanting to get out and hang out with friends and everything. I wasn’t really that concerned in the beginning of the pandemic about younger people. I still worried about it then, but when I heard covid was really starting to spread around to younger people I got concerned. Jason was hanging out with his friends, so I wasn’t that surprised when he got it. Still, I’m not as concerned, because they say the strain going around now is not as virulent as the strain in the beginning of the pandemic. And younger people have a much stronger constitution, so I’m not as worried about younger people than I am older people… They say the strain is not as potent. That’s why I think the president might have a strong constitution and the strain that he has is not as potent. I have a feeling he’ll recover, but I do have doubts. There are lasting effects for people who have had the virus, even if they had a mild case. If he continues to be our president, I find that very worrisome because I don’t think he’s that brilliant and we don’t know the lasting effects of the virus. I’m concerned about the future of the country for that reason and many other reasons than the president; our economy, people’s jobs, young people in school and the psychological impact-it’s horrible. The lasting effects of covid-19 are almost as worrisome as the disease itself.
Well, I don’t think I have any other questions. Is there anything that we haven’t talked about that you want to share about your experience or your thoughts on anything that relates to the pandemic?
I don’t think so, except for I consider myself very fortunate, especially that I still get to see and spend time with our family. Our family is VERY cautious, but we still are able to get together-we wear masks and social distance as much as possible. This is on a personal level. On a broader level, my big concern is the fallout effects of the disease itself, the effect on society and the economy…This is a big, big, big, big worry. Where is this all headed to? And, I don’t know when are we going to see level ground. I think it’ll take years for things to get back to normal, and it’s going a be a new normal, a different normal…and I have no idea what it’ll be and I don’t think anyone has any idea what it’ll be.